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[Miscellaneous] Rants on the Decline of Naruto (Part 2)


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#41 Hellion

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Posted 23 May 2015 - 07:37 PM

Obviously theres a difference of opinion or you clearly dont understand Naruto's character if you really think he wouldn't try to save Oorochimaru. Naruto forgave Nagato who killed his masters and destroyed his village and forgave obito, we're their crimes any less than Oorochimaru's? Furthermore Jiraya went after Oorochimaru right after he escaped from the third so there's no way he couldn't have known what he was up. He gave up on saving Oorochimaru because he felt like it was a lost cause. He even tried to tell Naruto about this before they left the village to train but Naruto was still determined to save Sasuke no matter what. Even after Jiraya's death when the K11 were trying to write Sasuke off, Naruto was having none that. So your point is invalid and makes no sense and it really seems YOU'RE basing things on what YOU would have done and not what the CHARACTERS in the MANGA would have done. Also Obito found out the truth about Rin early on and still chose to turn his back on his way up to the very end until Naruto got into his head and then he made a HEEL-FACE turn. Even then his crimes went above and beyond what Oorochimaru did so what point are you trying to make?

#42 Ace1225

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Posted 23 May 2015 - 07:57 PM

I've already made my point: Saying that Team 7 (Meaning Naruto and Sakura) showed greater morals or integrity than the Sannin (Meaning Jiraiya and Tsunade) because of how both reacted to Sasuke and Orochimaru respectively is silly as the circumstances of the two aren't exactly the same. The latter is far more dire than the former and it's therefore not an appropriate comparison. Everything else you're talking about has nothing to do with the original statement, and does nothing to prove your original statement, which was again that Team 7 surpassed the Sannin in terms of morals and integrity. 

 

In terms of Jiraiya and Orochimaru, there's no indication that he didn't speak with the 3rd before he went after Orochimaru, or even before the 3rd went after Orochimaru himself, which in both cases would make him aware of what Orochimaru had done. There's really not any information to state it for a fact one way or the other. All that's revealed is that he went after Orochimaru after Orochimaru had fled the village. Furthermore, he would later on learn the extent of Orochimaru's actions regardless, which played a part in him giving up on his former friend, who was a kidnapping murderer lol to say that someone who doesn't bother to chase after such a person and try to redeem them, but instead tries to bring them to justice, as is rightly deserved, isn't a moral person with integrity is silly. Seeking to bring such a person to justice is in fact everything that morality and integrity is about, especially as you (Jiraiya) were once a friend/teammate to said person, and may even feel somewhat responsible for him. And the same applies to Tsunade. They gave up on their teammate in the wake of him committing a tremendous amount of atrocities, the number of which would only grow after he fled the village. Sasuke was not the same as Orochimaru. Naruto and Sakura were not put under anywhere near the same pressure in regards to their wayward teammate, as he didn't committ as many crimes.

 

To be clear, i'm not saying that the Sannin are then more moral or possess more integrity than Naruto and Sakura do, as I find the very idea of any of these four people possessing more of either of those traits than the latter to be somewhat silly and unprovable. They all possess the traits plain and simple, and have shown them in a variety of ways.

 

You then switch in your next post to speaking about resolve. As I pointed out, Sakura's was absolutely nil, so that's a zero for Team 7 right there. You're then basically comparing Naruto to Jiraiya and Tsunade. This is another trait which I think all three characters portrayed within their lifetimes, and therefore find it silly to try to say that one showed it more than the other. Jiraiya willed himself back to life to get his village information on the enemy. Tsunade gave everything she had against Madara. And Naruto of course continually chased after Sasuke time and again. Each character has in his or her own way embodied the concept of resolve to the absolute fullest. There's therefore no generational "surpassing" going on in this story. I could even take it back further to Hashirama's time if I wanted to.


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I can't force you to believe me that's your choice. People live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define "reality". But what does it mean to be "correct" and "true?" Merely vague concepts...their reality may all be a mirage. Can we consider them to simply be living in their own world, shaped by their beliefs?-Itachi Uchiha


#43 Sasuke K

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 07:22 AM

Also, Sakura's resolve in the entire situation was an absolute zero. Naruto proved he had resolve. Sakura did absolutely nothing to go after Sasuke, try to redeem Sasuke, or to ensure his return to the village one day. She dumped the entire situation on Naruto, felt bad about it, tried to kill Sasuke, and failed twice in the same day because she couldn't go through with it. Then she spent the rest of the series feeling bad about it. Her resolve is as weak as tap water.

 

after all, TL proved that Sakura used naruto to redeem Sasuke and discarded Naruto on a whim and end their bonds off screen. The light novels of their interactions together proves that. Now I know is unlikely, but I just wonder if Kishi will do a plot to on Sakura's dark past and revealed that she regretted her decision because it seems in the first chapter that she's not obsessed with Sasuke as she normally is with her younger self and in those light novels.


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#44 waleuska

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Posted 25 May 2015 - 01:09 PM

after all, TL proved that Sakura used naruto to redeem Sasuke and discarded Naruto on a whim and end their bonds off screen. The light novels of their interactions together proves that. Now I know is unlikely, but I just wonder if Kishi will do a plot to on Sakura's dark past and revealed that she regretted her decision because it seems in the first chapter that she's not obsessed with Sasuke as she normally is with her younger self and in those light novels.

What dark past? And once again stop reading fan fiction and watch TL and stop making stuff up.


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#45 Sasuke K

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Posted 26 May 2015 - 02:38 AM

What dark past? And once again stop reading fan fiction and watch TL and stop making stuff up.


You ever heard of plot twists? In fact you see them a lot in this series. You want to rub FF in my face than tell me or explain to me why Sakura could not get over him and why did she fell in love or had a crush on him.? i don't want to listen to your pro-anti Sakura comments. Just correct me the way you did with TL with the kB scene. I must have missed it. Remember, Sakura said in the movie that she and Hinata are similar and that she cannot get over her "first love". Care to explain that too.

Edited by Sasuke K, 26 May 2015 - 02:40 AM.

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#46 SoulFire

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 08:27 AM

after all, TL proved that Sakura used naruto to redeem Sasuke and discarded Naruto on a whim and end their bonds off screen. The light novels of their interactions together proves that. Now I know is unlikely, but I just wonder if Kishi will do a plot to on Sakura's dark past and revealed that she regretted her decision because it seems in the first chapter that she's not obsessed with Sasuke as she normally is with her younger self and in those light novels.

You certainly have an interesting head canon going on. Sakura never 'discarded' Naruto or ended their bond. She just never was in love with him (nor he with her, which is what she addressed in TL). They remain friends on the level of siblings--the bond that they formed over the years in Team 7.

 

As to what is going on in NG, it is all up in the air at this point--Kishi loves to be mysterious--but I doubt that it has anything to do with Sakura's 'dark past' or her regrets. It's all about the mission that Sasuke is on. Things will become clearer and make more sense once we know the whys and wherefores of that mission.



#47 OP Eyes FTW

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 09:35 PM

Obito's story could have possibly been good even with the same elements driving him (namely, Rin's death etc.) if Kishi would have just done a few things differently. He could have emphasized the fact that Obito was an orphan; we actually did not know that until 600 chapters in. If he would have been a sociopathic freak from his youth, then had a sick fixation on Rin, then gone berserk after her death, maybe his story could have been buyable––if he was already crazy, but Rin sort of acted as a pacifier that kept him in check for a while, then he goes completely nuts after she died.


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#48 Ace1225

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 09:42 PM

Obito's story could have possibly been good even with the same elements driving him (namely, Rin's death etc.) if Kishi would have just done a few things differently. He could have emphasized the fact that Obito was an orphan; we actually did not know that until 600 chapters in. If he would have been a sociopathic freak from his youth, then had a sick fixation on Rin, then gone berserk after her death, maybe his story could have been buyable––if he was already crazy, but Rin sort of acted as a pacifier that kept him in check for a while, then he goes completely nuts after she died.

Exactly. Hell, more focus on both Obito and Rin as characters, and their relationship, along with even Obito's relationship with Kakashi, would have made him a more compelling villain, a more believable villain, and an overall more tragic villain. If he was going to have the role he did in this story the Gaiden should've been like 10-20 chapters long honestly.


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I can't force you to believe me that's your choice. People live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define "reality". But what does it mean to be "correct" and "true?" Merely vague concepts...their reality may all be a mirage. Can we consider them to simply be living in their own world, shaped by their beliefs?-Itachi Uchiha


#49 retroluffy13

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Posted 27 May 2015 - 09:56 PM

Exactly. Hell, more focus on both Obito and Rin as characters, and their relationship, along with even Obito's relationship with Kakashi, would have made him a more compelling villain, a more believable villain, and an overall more tragic villain. If he was going to have the role he did in this story the Gaiden should've been like 10-20 chapters long honestly.

well kishi did sorta take that direction, but more or less did it in a "gloss over the important stuff" kinda way. he did establish by the end of the manga that all Uchiha were basicly criminally insane people because of theyre genetic makeup.

but yeah. It would have been cool if kishi had used obito to establish this trait rather then just randomly exposit the information on us through tobirama..

Edited by retroluffy13, 27 May 2015 - 09:57 PM.

 this is a music video I made for a friend of mine.  give it a listen.  the visuals are pretty dope

Spoiler


also some ear kandy
Spoiler

when you love something..  and I mean. really love it.  you fight for it for as long as you can until you cant stand any longer.  then when its all said and done, walk away with a smile hoping you did right.

#50 retroluffy13

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Posted 30 May 2015 - 12:47 AM

retro rips 5

Spoiler

 this is a music video I made for a friend of mine.  give it a listen.  the visuals are pretty dope

Spoiler


also some ear kandy
Spoiler

when you love something..  and I mean. really love it.  you fight for it for as long as you can until you cant stand any longer.  then when its all said and done, walk away with a smile hoping you did right.

#51 retroluffy13

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Posted 05 June 2015 - 10:53 PM


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 this is a music video I made for a friend of mine.  give it a listen.  the visuals are pretty dope

Spoiler


also some ear kandy
Spoiler

when you love something..  and I mean. really love it.  you fight for it for as long as you can until you cant stand any longer.  then when its all said and done, walk away with a smile hoping you did right.

#52 Five-Tailed-Fenrir

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 08:42 AM

 

"Look at Sasuke's wtf face.. what a mook."

 

Lol, that was actually an enjoyable watch.


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#53 retroluffy13

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 09:52 AM

"Look at Sasuke's wtf face.. what a mook."
 
Lol, that was actually an enjoyable watch.

they've been getting better every episode. at least I think they have.

 this is a music video I made for a friend of mine.  give it a listen.  the visuals are pretty dope

Spoiler


also some ear kandy
Spoiler

when you love something..  and I mean. really love it.  you fight for it for as long as you can until you cant stand any longer.  then when its all said and done, walk away with a smile hoping you did right.

#54 Sasuke K

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 01:15 PM

NH fans signed an i-petition to have kishi destroy NS fandom.

 

Don't tell me that these NHtards feel threatened by NS sudden friendship being resurrected and that they stoop so low as to flag their gums to kishi by signing this stupid petition. Petitions means nothing. 

 

GIF--laughing-funny-LOL-haha-hehe-hilari


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#55 Tokoya

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 10:14 PM

NH fans signed an i-petition to have kishi destroy NS fandom.

Don't tell me that these NHtards feel threatened by NS sudden friendship being resurrected and that they stoop so low as to flag their gums to kishi by signing this stupid petition. Petitions means nothing.

http://reactiongif.org/wp-content/upload...

I bet this was orchestrated by NS people
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#56 Darthwin

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Posted 09 June 2015 - 11:08 PM

I am going to sit back and enjoy the fireworks. Reading Naruto was pretty much part of my schedule so I should find some enjoyment out of the last bits of the ride that had a decent start and weak ending to Naruto's story. More interested in Sarada then Bolt. 

 

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Edited by Darthwin, 09 June 2015 - 11:08 PM.


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#57 Sasuke K

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 05:06 AM

I bet this was orchestrated by NS people

 

Either that or it can be anybody. I know last year one of the 2 NS petitions was made by a NHtard to troll the NS fandom.  


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#58 Sasuke K

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 03:22 PM

What the fuck is this shit!

 

 

Spoiler The Official Daughter Of Lee's Sketch/Scrap

 

Don't tell me that's...


Edited by Sasuke K, 10 June 2015 - 03:23 PM.

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#59 Darthwin

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 04:10 PM

Words escape me.


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#60 MAX_COLA_POWER!

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Posted 10 June 2015 - 04:15 PM

If the mother is who we think it is, I think it should be considered the final nail on this character's coffin.






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