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Fairy Tail Chapter 516 Discussion


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#61 Darthwin

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Posted 30 December 2016 - 02:00 PM

Yeah the end result of Zeref being close to fairy heart was a fluke she had not control over they would all end up. If I am remembering correctly that was also the first time she ever used that spell and was not sure how well it would go.

Either way she sent her subordinate who should not have been on the front lines at all considering his defeat meant losing the forces their revived. So while she was winning she was also undermining her own forces along the way.
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#62 captain kidd

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Posted 30 December 2016 - 02:41 PM

Yeah the end result of Zeref being close to fairy heart was a fluke she had not control over they would all end up. If I am remembering correctly that was also the first time she ever used that spell and was not sure how well it would go.

Either way she sent her subordinate who should not have been on the front lines at all considering his defeat meant losing the forces their revived. So while she was winning she was also undermining her own forces along the way.


Yes but her intention was to speed up the war and that is why she did it.

As for sending neinheart. That isn't her fault that he was weak. She obviously helped him out and he was a big deal. He just had the misfortune to run into defeat quick...
 
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#63 Darthwin

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Posted 30 December 2016 - 03:49 PM

It was still a gamble that only worked in her favor.

It's her fault for sending him in the first place since its a stupid idea to send someone that is keeping a portion of your elite forces alive. It goes to show she does puts her own wants above the needs of zerefs objective.

She is not even following the task she was given and just went on her own mission despite the fact that she chastised zeref for being slow about getting things done.
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#64 Fenrix

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Posted 30 December 2016 - 05:29 PM

Lol, I didn't realize a chapter had come out  :^_^:

 

Tbh, I'm more interested in Natsu's story than this fight. Like, what is the big revelation or solution to Natsu's dying that Mashima's been building up to for the last several chapters? What I think might happen next with this fight:

 

1) Wendy regains control of her body either through some nakama BS or enchantment, thus forcing a weakened spirit-Irene to return to her own body

 

or

 

2) Some negative side effect happens because Irene leaves her body (idk, probably something to do with the fact that Zeref gave her that body?)



#65 alekos23

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Posted 31 December 2016 - 08:00 AM

If I may interject here,Universe One required quite some prep time to cast,AND was from Irene using the magic flow in the ground.Think Azuma on Tenrou Island.

 

While certainly skilled,not an instant thing.Plus plot armour that let her survive Acno cause "Le Important Erza plot".



#66 KUROkami

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Posted 31 December 2016 - 11:09 AM

If I may interject here,Universe One required quite some prep time to cast,AND was from Irene using the magic flow in the ground.Think Azuma on Tenrou Island.

While certainly skilled,not an instant thing.Plus plot armour that let her survive Acno cause "Le Important Erza plot".


Plot armor has saved half the main cast since day 1
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#67 Madara D Dragon

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Posted 02 January 2017 - 01:32 PM

ok, we all knew no matter what, given irene's impressive list of accomplishments it was going to be BS when she is defeated.


but like this? not like this.......



come on, this is just nonsense, the "secret weapon" was defeated by sting....who has never been relevant. irene was countered by wendy who has never impressed with her enchantment magic....

stay tuned for august to be defeated by max.......or the telepathy guy


Better yet. Happy will defeat acnologia. Acnplogia will go kamikaze flying against Natsu, and Happy will fly and butt heads and know what? Happy will block him, because his flying undoes Acnologia's... You know... this guy doesn't even bother using the friendship boost to make anyone win against the evil masterminds, he just makes the most useless character beat the most hyped without any explanation. And people still wonder why we would argue about Erza beating Zoro... any Fairy Tail character (from the FT guild) can beat any othe r character from any manga, you jist have to read this to see so.

But honestly people, I would be perfectly fine if FT fans were just like "ok, this doesn't make a lot of sense, but whatever, I like the manga and I'll go on reading it". What desperates me the most is seeing people trying to argue the unarguable.. sigh.
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#68 Fenrix

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Posted 02 January 2017 - 03:02 PM


And people still wonder why we would argue about Erza beating Zoro... any Fairy Tail character (from the FT guild) can beat any othe r character from any manga, you jist have to read this to see so.

Hmm, if these fights were written by Mashima himself, probably. Realistically, hell no.

 


But honestly people, I would be perfectly fine if FT fans were just like "ok, this doesn't make a lot of sense, but whatever, I like the manga and I'll go on reading it". What desperates me the most is seeing people trying to argue the unarguable.. sigh.

But that would make for boring discussion  :P For the most part, we all know that FT doesn't make sense yet we still read it because we like it or out of loyalty since we've probably been reading it for awhile. Why else would we come back each week? The way I see it, where Mashima fails to provide logical explanation, it's ok for readers to come up with their own, lol? 



#69 Madara D Dragon

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Posted 02 January 2017 - 05:26 PM

Hmm, if these fights were written by Mashima himself, probably. Realistically, hell no.

That's exactly what I mean. Put the any other manga character inside the FT manga, and no matter who he/she is, he/she will lose, because the power of friendship will always win. I honestly am a guy who admits a lot of "good guys always win" ideas, we all knew Naruto was going to become Hokage, we all know Luffy is going to become Pirate King, and so on, and I'm fine with it, but FT reaches an absurd point of "good people always win", which makes every hype, every explanation of evil people... everything less interesting, as the power levels are so fucked up it feels like you know what's going to happen again and again. I think Mashima goes too far with that to the poiny that it affects the perception of a guy who doesn't care if good guys win 100% of the time, but making them win against villains with which they shouldn't win, and making the reason to win sheer friendship boost made this manga which I grew a big interest in turn less interesting to my chapter by chapter. (and apart from that, I personaly hate how this author focuses more on showing ass and boobs than making good characters or story).

I really try not to rant about this, because I know it's annoying to read someone complaining about the manga you like (so I'm really sorry for those who I'm anoying), but its one thing to like the manga and try to argue for the things the author doesn't give sense to (I also do that), and the other is creating nonsensical arguments to defend it, or to make as if the guy complaining about the lac of logic was being nonsensical. Loving something is good, but being critic about it, or simply admiting when something doesn't look logical makes discussions really easier :)
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#70 1ch1go

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Posted 02 January 2017 - 08:35 PM

PLOT ARMOR is indeed the most powerful enchantment spell...


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#71 Graeystone

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Posted 03 January 2017 - 12:59 PM

Wendy; a young girl with long black hair in a story made in Japan. . .what could go wrong? Ringu(The Ring). . .The Grudge. . .


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#72 captain kidd

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:20 PM

Better yet. Happy will defeat acnologia. Acnplogia will go kamikaze flying against Natsu, and Happy will fly and butt heads and know what? Happy will block him, because his flying undoes Acnologia's... You know... this guy doesn't even bother using the friendship boost to make anyone win against the evil masterminds, he just makes the most useless character beat the most hyped without any explanation. And people still wonder why we would argue about Erza beating Zoro... any Fairy Tail character (from the FT guild) can beat any othe r character from any manga, you jist have to read this to see so.

But honestly people, I would be perfectly fine if FT fans were just like "ok, this doesn't make a lot of sense, but whatever, I like the manga and I'll go on reading it". What desperates me the most is seeing people trying to argue the unarguable.. sigh.


I wouldn't be surprised to see happy beat arcnologia at this point. Maybe fro will help him.....

About erza vs zoro oh my god thank you for getting me started. Zoro had no place winning that fight. Zoro comes from a manga that has rules and limits where erza is neo from the matrix and realistically would of shown Zoro what he fears the most a world where no one gets defeated... erza getting tortured was at minium 10x Zoro's TB feat. And after that feat and a few days Zoro couldn't even fight without shuddering in pain brook even had to comment. Erza after getting tortured for a whole day.... then proceeded to fight an entire arc and puncture a mountain with a single move..... Zoro has to obey his mangas laws and gets defeated in situations that make sense (like against kizaru) where's erza defeated an opponent when she had no sense of touch smell sight and so much pain a powerhouse like minerza couldn't even stand up. And to make t the absolute worst they used out dated feats to approximate Zoros speed..... 1st off erza was fast enough to slash the very best swordsman in FT so I don't know how you can judge that. 2nd, Zoro has nothing to deal with erza how does speed even matter?

How could the same guys that got superman vs goku so right get erza vs Zoro so wrong? I can see them all in their office right now
"Hey, ever since bleach and naruto died this FT manga has gotten more popular want to cash in on it and make a fight video?"
"Sure, has anyone read FT?"
"No one?? Well everyone go home and read 10 chapters each so we can think of a reason why erza loses to zoro"
" I know power! We can claim that pica's ever changing height and mass is I don't know let's pull a number out of our ass.... 200 tons, then calculate the power required to do pop up like it did. Then equate that to bombs to fool the fans!"
"Good what about speed?"
"Speed...... well there was a gag scene where Zoro kinda disappeared for a joke but it was over the course of 3 panels and we don't really know when the fodder he was fighting noticed he was gone"
"Non sense, that is a feat we will say Zoro moves so fast no one could see him, what do we have on durability?"
"Well erza tanked an islands worth of explosive power twice and Zoro was defeated by a slash to the chest"
"Um........."
"Should we not mention it?"
"Don't mention it, no one will notice, disability doesn't really matter in a fight anyway"

Compelete garbage.
 

That's exactly what I mean. Put the any other manga character inside the FT manga, and no matter who he/she is, he/she will lose, because the power of friendship will always win. I honestly am a guy who admits a lot of "good guys always win" ideas, we all knew Naruto was going to become Hokage, we all know Luffy is going to become Pirate King, and so on, and I'm fine with it, but FT reaches an absurd point of "good people always win", which makes every hype, every explanation of evil people... everything less interesting, as the power levels are so fucked up it feels like you know what's going to happen again and again. I think Mashima goes too far with that to the poiny that it affects the perception of a guy who doesn't care if good guys win 100% of the time, but making them win against villains with which they shouldn't win, and making the reason to win sheer friendship boost made this manga which I grew a big interest in turn less interesting to my chapter by chapter. (and apart from that, I personaly hate how this author focuses more on showing ass and boobs than making good characters or story).

I really try not to rant about this, because I know it's annoying to read someone complaining about the manga you like (so I'm really sorry for those who I'm anoying), but its one thing to like the manga and try to argue for the things the author doesn't give sense to (I also do that), and the other is creating nonsensical arguments to defend it, or to make as if the guy complaining about the lac of logic was being nonsensical. Loving something is good, but being critic about it, or simply admiting when something doesn't look logical makes discussions really easier :)


I feel like every fight hiro goes though the same thing Oda did when he sent Fuji to DR. Writing himself into a corner.

"Oh no I did an awesome job hyping up Irene, who could possibly beat her..... um..... well enchantments.... Wendy! Wendy does enchantments.... also.... erza, erza beats everyone. Maybe..... should I throw in some natsu?"

You know what is actually a good comparison. Hiro is like Oda on crack. Instead of mihawk showing up and beating Zoro easily without even trying only for Zoro to slowly and steadily grow stronger and stronger till he can one day beat mihawk. Hiro would have that all occur over the course of 5 chapters.
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#73 Madara D Dragon

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 01:03 PM

I wouldn't be surprised to see happy beat arcnologia at this point. Maybe fro will help him.....

About erza vs zoro oh my god thank you for getting me started. Zoro had no place winning that fight. Zoro comes from a manga that has rules and limits where erza is neo from the matrix and realistically would of shown Zoro what he fears the most a world where no one gets defeated... erza getting tortured was at minium 10x Zoro's TB feat. And after that feat and a few days Zoro couldn't even fight without shuddering in pain brook even had to comment. Erza after getting tortured for a whole day.... then proceeded to fight an entire arc and puncture a mountain with a single move..... Zoro has to obey his mangas laws and gets defeated in situations that make sense (like against kizaru) where's erza defeated an opponent when she had no sense of touch smell sight and so much pain a powerhouse like minerza couldn't even stand up. And to make t the absolute worst they used out dated feats to approximate Zoros speed..... 1st off erza was fast enough to slash the very best swordsman in FT so I don't know how you can judge that. 2nd, Zoro has nothing to deal with erza how does speed even matter?

How could the same guys that got superman vs goku so right get erza vs Zoro so wrong? I can see them all in their office right now
"Hey, ever since bleach and naruto died this FT manga has gotten more popular want to cash in on it and make a fight video?"
"Sure, has anyone read FT?"
"No one?? Well everyone go home and read 10 chapters each so we can think of a reason why erza loses to zoro"
" I know power! We can claim that pica's ever changing height and mass is I don't know let's pull a number out of our ass.... 200 tons, then calculate the power required to do pop up like it did. Then equate that to bombs to fool the fans!"
"Good what about speed?"
"Speed...... well there was a gag scene where Zoro kinda disappeared for a joke but it was over the course of 3 panels and we don't really know when the fodder he was fighting noticed he was gone"
"Non sense, that is a feat we will say Zoro moves so fast no one could see him, what do we have on durability?"
"Well erza tanked an islands worth of explosive power twice and Zoro was defeated by a slash to the chest"
"Um........."
"Should we not mention it?"
"Don't mention it, no one will notice, disability doesn't really matter in a fight anyway"

Compelete garbage.
 

I feel like every fight hiro goes though the same thing Oda did when he sent Fuji to DR. Writing himself into a corner.

"Oh no I did an awesome job hyping up Irene, who could possibly beat her..... um..... well enchantments.... Wendy! Wendy does enchantments.... also.... erza, erza beats everyone. Maybe..... should I throw in some natsu?"

You know what is actually a good comparison. Hiro is like Oda on crack. Instead of mihawk showing up and beating Zoro easily without even trying only for Zoro to slowly and steadily grow stronger and stronger till he can one day beat mihawk. Hiro would have that all occur over the course of 5 chapters.


I actually didn't see the Zoro vd Erza battle explanation, so knowing how your posts usually are, it was interesting to think about which of the jokes you made where real feats they used and which weren't.

But as you said, when Oda drives himself into a corner, like with the Fuji situation, he creates an argument/excuse to undo it, as for example what he did in Dressrossa, be it more or less likeable/believable. The thing is Hiro's solution when he's written into a corner is to just fuck off that corner! "Oh my god, A cannot beat B! What have I done? How I'm gonna come out of this situation? Shall I create an argument for them not to fight...? No, I know it, better yet! I'll make A beat B, so that way B is no longer stronger than A, and so B being stronger than A will no longer be a factor! Or even better, I'll just use C, who is the weakest of all and make her beat everyooneee!!!
Oh, wait... it's the time to plan how many boobs and asses I'll show next chapter. Everybody out of the room, I have to concentrate to think of absurd arguments or pannel-angles to show more meat. this shit is serious right now!!"
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#74 captain kidd

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 02:04 PM

I actually didn't see the Zoro vd Erza battle explanation, so knowing how your posts usually are, it was interesting to think about which of the jokes you made where real feats they used and which weren't.

But as you said, when Oda drives himself into a corner, like with the Fuji situation, he creates an argument/excuse to undo it, as for example what he did in Dressrossa, be it more or less likeable/believable. The thing is Hiro's solution when he's written into a corner is to just fuck off that corner! "Oh my god, A cannot beat B! What have I done? How I'm gonna come out of this situation? Shall I create an argument for them not to fight...? No, I know it, better yet! I'll make A beat B, so that way B is no longer stronger than A, and so B being stronger than A will no longer be a factor! Or even better, I'll just use C, who is the weakest of all and make her beat everyooneee!!!
Oh, wait... it's the time to plan how many boobs and asses I'll show next chapter. Everybody out of the room, I have to concentrate to think of absurd arguments or pannel-angles to show more meat. this shit is serious right now!!"



Hahaha ya seriosuly. what we need is hiro to get a co-author. Hiro can still draw the boobs and hype the villains but half way through the arc the co author takes over and writes how these nonsense fights actually end.
 
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#75 Saya

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 05:25 PM

Hahaha ya seriosuly. what we need is hiro to get a co-author. Hiro can still draw the boobs and hype the villains but half way through the arc the co author takes over and writes how these nonsense fights actually end.

I enjoy reading FT for the story Hiro is writting so no....


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#76 captain kidd

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 07:20 AM

I enjoy reading FT for the story Hiro is writting so no....


Story is fine fights are garbage that could easily be fixed by a competent writer
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#77 masterbio

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 02:01 PM

Out on MS. Didn't even realised it was out yet here.

 

Btw, Ginyu did it better



#78 Tenno

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Posted 07 January 2017 - 04:31 PM

Wendy's EVUL!!!!

 

I knew the loli would do nothing but doom us all!


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#79 Saya

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 04:58 PM

Story is fine fights are garbage that could easily be fixed by a competent writer

Yeah but it is like you meant the whole story.



#80 captain kidd

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 01:08 PM

So Irene gave like 3 alternatives to the "dragon seed" how come she turned to Wendy and told her she has the dragon seed..... is Irene also aware Wendy is a main character?
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