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Cartoon Discussion (Part 4)


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#41 Acidrain

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 11:56 AM

He seems kinda full of himself sometimes. I loved him on community but I hate his reasons for leaving. Basically said he was gonna leave to pursue his rap career as childish gambino, which is already obnoxious, but then he ended up playing small parts in a ton of others shows and movies.


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#42 Kazekage

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 01:22 PM

He seems kinda full of himself sometimes. I loved him on community but I hate his reasons for leaving. Basically said he was gonna leave to pursue his rap career as childish gambino, which is already obnoxious, but then he ended up playing small parts in a ton of others shows and movies.

 

I am not a fan of hip hop so I don't really know how well he is doing in that area.  His role in 'Community' is all I need to know that he's got the chops for this part. 



#43 garlyle

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 11:21 AM

He didn't leave for Hip Hop. I love him as childish gambino. ( Centipede is the cut) He, like so many other young stars, is struggling with stardom. He wants to explore his options. Pretty sure he has his own show coming out for FX. I think it is called Atlanta. I don't love that he left Community the way he did, seeing as he was easily my favorite character, but I can understand why he felt he needed to do it.

 

I'm hoping the attention he brings to his role as spiderman could possibly open up the possibility to him getting a spin off show for the miles character. I haven't rocked with spider man in the comics since JMS, and haven't liked ANYTHING animated since Spectacular, but I will tune in to see how he does. Which, I think, was the point of getting him. He killed it as Marshall Lee...man, that just reminded me how badly I want a Fiona and Cake spin off.


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#44 Peleihno

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 08:25 PM

A lot of voice actors who voice teenage actors are much older than the characters they portray.  See Scott Menville, Will Freidle and Josh Keaton who were the voices of  TT Robin, Terry McGinnis and  Spec. Spider-man respectively.  

Honest question: what's wrong with Donald Glover?  I enjoyed him on Community but I've seen some people say they don't like him because of some RL stuff he did or is doing (can't recall the details).    

None of those characters were 13 though. It's just the guy doesn't have much work as a VA, so......I guess, lack of faith in his abilities.

Drake Bell had it easier, Peter was in high school in Ultimate Spiderman.

Anyway, I was never big on Donald Glover. I don't like Community much either. I liked his commentary about some uproar he got from clowns after news about Miles entering the world of animation though.

As for movies, I need Miles to played by a teenager in a live action movie not some 30 year old man. An important part about Miles is him being so young at the start of his era. It's cool to see a young hero that isn't a sidekick.
 

He seems kinda full of himself sometimes. I loved him on community but I hate his reasons for leaving. Basically said he was gonna leave to pursue his rap career as childish gambino, which is already obnoxious, but then he ended up playing small parts in a ton of others shows and movies.


Well, he doesn't really play into fads with his music far as I've seen. So, getting big gigs is harder for him. Everyone starts somewhere, it's a process.

And he is full of himself at times. Not long ago, he tried calling out Kendrick Lamar, Drake, and J.Cole at a concert of his in all the wrong ways. I don't even....but he's a good rapper surprisingly.

Edited by Peleihno, 28 August 2014 - 08:26 PM.

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#45 Kazekage

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 09:50 PM

None of those characters were 13 though. It's just the guy doesn't have much work as a VA, so......I guess, lack of faith in his abilities.

Drake Bell had it easier, Peter was in high school in Ultimate Spiderman.

Anyway, I was never big on Donald Glover. I don't like Community much either. I liked his commentary about some uproar he got from clowns after news about Miles entering the world of animation though.

As for movies, I need Miles to played by a teenager in a live action movie not some 30 year old man. An important part about Miles is him being so young at the start of his era. It's cool to see a young hero that isn't a sidekick.
 

Well, he doesn't really play into fads with his music far as I've seen. So, getting big gigs is harder for him. Everyone starts somewhere, it's a process.

And he is full of himself at times. Not long ago, he tried calling out Kendrick Lamar, Drake, and J.Cole at a concert of his in all the wrong ways. I don't even....but he's a good rapper surprisingly.

 

They could always age him up. Chances are this is a Miles who is already comfortable with being a super hero at this point. Peter's age has also varied depending on the movie and which point in life they are depicting him: a 15 year old teenager in Spec. Spider-man and a  20-something  college kid in Spider-man: The Animated Series,  Spider-man: TNAS and  the Raimi movies. Miles could easily be 16 or 17 in the cartoon.      

Plus, I figure that Donald wouldn't get the gig unless someone thought he did a good job in his audition. Drake Bell didn't do much voice work before he got the job on Ultimate Spider-man either.   


Edited by Kazekage, 28 August 2014 - 09:56 PM.


#46 Vl731

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 10:08 PM

Aging up is never really a good idea and if they are going to try and attract kids to the story aging him up would be an even worst idea, and remember this is Disney marvel we are talking about. Though I think what sets Peter apart from Miles is that through the years we've seen Peter become Spider-man at different ages depending on who was writing him; with Miles we only have this one origin story.


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#47 Kazekage

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 11:26 PM

Aging up is never really a good idea and if they are going to try and attract kids to the story aging him up would be an even worst idea, and remember this is Disney marvel we are talking about. Though I think what sets Peter apart from Miles is that through the years we've seen Peter become Spider-man at different ages depending on who was writing him; with Miles we only have this one origin story.

 

I don't mean age him up by several decades.  A 16-17 year old  something protagonist  isn't going to alienate the all important kid audience and with characters like Spider-man, it's more about the teen audience than the kid ones.  Spider-man: TAS, Batman Beyond and others attracted audiences with protagonists who were between 17 and 24 and still appealed to kids.  Plus minor characters means even greater opportunity for writers to change the characters.  



#48 garlyle

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 12:19 AM

Ugh. Forgot that there is some unwritten rule that all Modern spiderman has to be bogged down with unneeded teen drama. You brought up B:TAS; back then, no one was under the assumption that 'kids' couldn't appreciate a show unless the characters were shoehorned into school. Batman, X-Men, The Tick, Rocko's Modern Life, Ren and Stimpy, Garfield and Friends, Animaniacs, Darkwing Duck; none of them were set around a school. Fast forward a decade and EVERY kids show was set in a school.

 

It's only recently that they're slowly bucking this trend. Adventure Time, Steven Universe, Regular Show, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Legend of Korra (though Korra has enough teen drama to make up for that, bleh).



#49 Acidrain

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 02:15 AM

I love cartoons that take place in highschool.....


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#50 AndrewR5D4

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 02:46 AM

There are plenty of exceptions, especially if the superhero in question is NOT under Disney's logo. Generator Rex didn't take place in or even near a school... Quite the opposite, since the main character was noticeably exempt from education due to a series of very unique circumstances. I don't think Ben 10 ever set foot in school aside from a few episodes for less than a minute or two. I think the team that created those two series were going for Teenage Superhero not high-school drama.



#51 Kazekage

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 04:42 AM

There are plenty of exceptions, especially if the superhero in question is NOT under Disney's logo. Generator Rex didn't take place in or even near a school... Quite the opposite, since the main character was noticeably exempt from education due to a series of very unique circumstances. I don't think Ben 10 ever set foot in school aside from a few episodes for less than a minute or two. I think the team that created those two series were going for Teenage Superhero not high-school drama.

 

Man of Action produced both the original Ben 10 series and Generator Rex. They are also the ones who are making Ultimate Spider-man.

When it comes to teenage high school shows, it really depends on how they handle the show. Generator Rex, X-Men Evolution, Danny Phantom and Teen Titans handled teen characters relatively well, imo.  However, I despise the new Max Steel show because the original felt more unique and there is this  "Guide Book to Writing Teens In Shows For  40 Year Old"  quality to the show. I see that show up every now and then; that artificial feel of the dialogue with characters saying 'totally' and some characters that feel like they were taken out of the stock closet and dusted off and refurbished for the show. Oh look there is the disappointed girl friend, there is the excited perky girl who falls for the hero, there is the evil jock, there is the father figure and mentor, there is the sassy likely single mom, etc, etc.  I mean, yes, I've said in the past that every thing is a remix but god dam it, the great thing about using stock characters is being to do something new with them. I could see shades of the aforementioned 'Teen Guide Book' even in Spec. Spider-man but they make up for it with good writing and character development.     

 


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#52 Peleihno

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 07:56 AM

Man of Action produced both the original Ben 10 series and Generator Rex. They are also the ones who are making Ultimate Spider-man.

When it comes to teenage high school shows, it really depends on how they handle the show. Generator Rex, X-Men Evolution, Danny Phantom and Teen Titans handled teen characters relatively well, imo.  However, I despise the new Max Steel show because the original felt more unique and there is this  "Guide Book to Writing Teens In Shows For  40 Year Old"  quality to the show. I see that show up every now and then; that artificial feel of the dialogue with characters saying 'totally' and some characters that feel like they were taken out of the stock closet and dusted off and refurbished for the show. Oh look there is the disappointed girl friend, there is the excited perky girl who falls for the hero, there is the evil jock, there is the father figure and mentor, there is the sassy likely single mom, etc, etc.  I mean, yes, I've said in the past that every thing is a remix but god dam it, the great thing about using stock characters is being to do something new with them. I could see shades of the aforementioned 'Teen Guide Book' even in Spec. Spider-man but they make up for it with good writing and character development.     

 


Generator Rex >> Ben 10.

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#53 garlyle

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:12 AM

Danny Phantom STILL hurts. It had SO much potential. He had so many ghost powers that he just never used. It always revolved around high school drama and never went beyond that. Paradoxically though, I LOVE almost any manga/anime set in high school. The tropes for those series don't rely on the main character making asinine decisions nearly as much and I find it enjoyable. I guess because the main similarity between every high school scenario in the US is cruelty, I just can't get behind it.

 

So, did Cartoon Network recently come under new management, and if so, are they going to stop assassinating every action show I love?



#54 Kazekage

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:01 AM

What I disliked about Danny Phantom was the occasional terrible nonsensical decisions they have characters make. For example, in one episode, Danny's parents find out about his ghost powers and tell him it's okay but he erases their memory anyway because 'Status Quo Is God'

Then there was the big finale movie, I love Sam but I hated her in it. After Danny decides to give up his ghost powers she basically breaks up with him saying he is not special anymore and sulking about him making his decision to get rid of his powers because of how things have effected him. News flash lady, it's not your powers.  I've always felt that there was an untold subtext where Sam really wanted the powers that Danny had but because that was not the case and because she doesn't want the attention it would bring, she instead settled for helping him in the background and got pissed when she can no longer live out her fantasies when he got rid of his powers.

Dark Danny though, that's what made the show for me.  It's not often that you see a kid's show go to such dark places and they even left it ambiguous so there was always potential that Danny could become Dark Danny.


 


 

Generator Rex >> Ben 10.

 

Eh, apples and oranges.  Ben 10 was meant to be kiddy and kind of cheesy while Generator Rex was their dark, mature teen show set in a post apocalyptic world. I think both are good examples of superhero shows that don't star an established character like Superman and Batman. Though yes, Ben and Rex are based on two minor DC characters but they are made so different from their comic incarnations. 


Edited by Kazekage, 29 August 2014 - 11:02 AM.

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#55 garlyle

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:02 AM

I wish Danny Phantom would have been made seven years earlier or later. If it had been made then, it would have been given more lee way to really explore its depths. What always upset me was he NEVER used his awesome ghost wail and rarely used his ice abilities. Ghost wail was awesome!



#56 Acidrain

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:22 AM

I was always just kind of annoyed by how he has "ghost powers"....that never really made sense to me. You either are a ghost or you arent. You know Deadman from DC comics? He has ghost powers...but he's also an actual GHOST.

Being "half ghost half human" just seems stupid to me.


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#57 Kazekage

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:33 AM

He is a human who has been imbued with the stuff that makes ghosts... ghosts.  Replace 'spider' and 'radiation' with ghosts and ectoplasm and you get Danny Phantom.  
 


Edited by Kazekage, 29 August 2014 - 11:36 AM.

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#58 Acidrain

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:47 AM

He is a human who has been imbued with the stuff that makes ghosts... ghosts.  Replace 'spider' and 'radiation' with ghosts and ectoplasm and you get Danny Phantom.  
 

ugh yeah but a ghost is a ghost...its like saying somebody is half "spirit". A ghost isnt another SPECIES its a state of being. Life and death. Human and Spirit.

 

I dont know. Something about it just rubs me the wrong way.


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#59 Kazekage

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:47 AM

I wish Danny Phantom would have been made seven years earlier or later. If it had been made then, it would have been given more lee way to really explore its depths. What always upset me was he NEVER used his awesome ghost wail and rarely used his ice abilities. Ghost wail was awesome!

 

7 years later would put it in the 90's and subject it to the strict rating system of the era if not, we would have gotten a much darker, semi realistic show which could have been awesome though I am not sure if I want another darker show in place of the lighter one we got and 7 years later....well I am not sure what kind of show we would have gotten whether good or bad but it wouldn't have been the same show and no guarantee that it would have been better. I think it came at the right with the introduction of lighter more kid and teen friendly superhero cartoons that had a sense of humor to it. It fit in nicely alongside Ben 10,  The Life & Times of Juniper Lee and  American Dragon Jake Long.  

The Danny Phantom show didn't have a lot of great action scenes from what I remember. It's been a long time so I can't recall the fine details of how the used his abilities and whether there were any glaring moments where he didn't use a specific power in his arsenal where he could have easily done so (though no story ever escapes that scrutiny). 

 



#60 waleuska

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:48 AM

He is a human who has been imbued with the stuff that makes ghosts... ghosts.  Replace 'spider' and 'radiation' with ghosts and ectoplasm and you get Danny Phantom.  
 

but ghost are dead people. Danny phantom is not dead. Saying he is half ghost means that he is half dead.


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