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[Character] Vinsmoke Sanji (Part 28)


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#301 Kid Frost

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 09:14 PM

Although now that i get how that was discribed in the manga i am totally confused since sound waves =/= electrical signales....how is that supposed to work?


I think it's supposed to work pretty much the same as with cell phones or any other radio communication. Though if you don't know how cell phones work a more simple analogy would be a standard baby monitor. When the sound an infant makes is picked up by the transmitter it is converted into radio waves and sent to the receiver which is the heard by the parent; in this analogy Enel is the parent and the citizens of Skypeia are the infants.  The basic idea is that Enel functions as both the transmitter and receiver antenna through the Goro Goro no Mi and coverts sound into radio waves (which are electromagnetic radiation in the first place) and then back into sound again once it reaches his ears allowing him to interpret any conversation within his radius.


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#302 Fulmine

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 10:48 PM


Since thoughts are elctrical signals +chemistry/biology i thought u meant he actually understands them and acts according to that.



EDIT: Is my former understanding disproven? I genuinly though Enel could read thoughts after the above statement... If so that links him to future seeing. If his DF does not allow him to read ones thoughts, yet if he truly gave an exact sentence about what someone was to say like Katakuri did then thats future seeing as well, as long as its not based on his DF that is. But if he can "only" hear the sentences others speak in a moment thus not able to fortell them, that would not be.

Can someone clear this up for me pls? Got me confused....

Well, very easy, if Enel could straight up read thoughts he should have known that Luffy's hitting the golden wall is to make his punches reflected without intention to hit Enel. But Enel didn't know, despite using his DF and CoO all day long. That's the proof you need that Enel doesn't read thoughts.

 

He may be able to read thoughts with his DF, but apparently he doesn't do it or more likely doesn't know how to. The thing is just because your ability has a bunch of application doesn't mean you know you're capable of these things, much less using. That's why we need creative/knowledgeable users. Look at Luffy! He takes advantage of his rubber body and produce G2-4. Someone who doesn't know how rubber functions or has not the slightest idea about its properties or mechanics wouldn't think of G2 or G4. G3 is simple though.


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#303 Strobacaxi

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 04:28 AM


Btw, Katakuri's seeing the future is still built on reading intention. It's an advanced CoO, like Bege said, not a new ability. So he doesn't actually have an ability that lets him see the future, it's just that his CoO is so good it reads intention that far into the future and there's images play in his mind.
 
If he can literally see the future regardless of intention then he wouldn't be surprised Luffy ran away the moment he was reminded of G4's time limit. His seeing the future clearly is limited only to ''natural'' course of action. The moment Katakuri actively acts on the circumstance and changes it, he's unable to see the future for a bit of time.
 

I partially agree with you. I think he doesn't read intentions. Pudding had no intention of falling on her knees and crying, but Katakuri saw that happening anyways. He literally sees the future, but from the moment he interferes, the future changes, which is why Luffy is able to dodge him, but not hit him. When he is being attacked he only acts on the last possible moment so as to not change the future 

He was surprised Luffy ran away because he interfered. In the future he saw, Luffy ran out of G4. In the actual timeline, he told Luffy about the time limit, so he changed the future and Luffy ran away


Edited by Strobacaxi, 02 December 2017 - 04:29 AM.

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#304 Fulmine

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 08:39 AM


I think he doesn't read intentions. Pudding had no intention of falling on her knees and crying, but Katakuri saw that happening anyways.

He does, only so far into the future (relatively speaking in One Piece context anw. Compared to superpowers that can predict things hours or months in advance in other fiction, calling this ''so far'' is kinda ridiculously insulting LOL). That's why I'm trying to explain it by using the word ''natural''. If things proceed naturally, then even if the intention has not formed in one's mind yet, the action still inevitably comes. Because sooner or later that intention would come into existence anw, and then the action.

 

So yeah, unlike several other CoO users we have seen, Katakuri doesn't just start reading intention the moment it appears in one's head, but he still reads intentions, only that he reads it in advance, like a logical follow-up of the intention/action before that and so on and so on, up to what he is currently seeing (it goes backward, if you know what I mean).

 

Because, how can he not read intention? It is CoO, so of course the mechanism is that of CoO, otherwise it would just be a different ability. Bege's words demonstrates that clearly and literally: ''he honed it so much he can see a bit into the future''. So it is reading intention, only that far ahead.

 

Btw, we have been using reading intention but I think the correct term is still listening to body's voice that Ganfor said in Skypiea.

 

 


He literally sees the future, but from the moment he interferes, the future changes, which is why Luffy is able to dodge him, but not hit him

No, Luffy dodged him because...he simply could react and dodged him. Remember that Katakuri already changed direction and attacked the position Luffy dodged to (which means he can still see the future at this time, which makes sense because that's what even normal/base CoO does, predicting immediate movement), which is why Luffy said he was twice as beat: he has to dodge twice. It's just that even when Katakuri changed the attack, Luffy can still react fast enough to dodge again whereas Katakuri can't repeat a second time. This is different from the limit we're talking about.

 

Clearly close combat gets same treatment like it does back in Skypiea or past arcs. If every time he makes an action, Katakuri is unable to see the future for a bit of time, then his CoO is only for defense and that's canonically false, cause like I said above, he used it to attack where Luffy would dodge to.

I think it's only considered ''changing the future'' in certain cases and we have seen them. But what the common trait between these cases is and how exactly this works I don't know. The only idea I have is maybe in those cases, the change is big enough to shift the future onto a different enough path (this starts to sound like Steins;Gate LOL and I am not sure if Oda puts that much thought into it. He's not the physics type. Hell, maybe he just does it as he likes for plot/choreography convenience, which means all these explanation is for naught :lolxg: :lolxg: :lolxg: )


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#305 captain kidd

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Posted 04 December 2017 - 10:06 AM

I partially agree with you. I think he doesn't read intentions. Pudding had no intention of falling on her knees and crying, but Katakuri saw that happening anyways. He literally sees the future, but from the moment he interferes, the future changes, which is why Luffy is able to dodge him, but not hit him. When he is being attacked he only acts on the last possible moment so as to not change the future
He was surprised Luffy ran away because he interfered. In the future he saw, Luffy ran out of G4. In the actual timeline, he told Luffy about the time limit, so he changed the future and Luffy ran away


And that is the problem. Because you cant "change the future" it is impossible to change something that doesnt exist yet.

If i go to buy a car, and i leave saying i want a chevy, but i come home with a ford, i didnt change the future, i changed my mind in the present, that in turn lead to the future. The future was not changed.

So once again. If you go to a fortune teller. And she says "you will marry kate upton" the next day she dies in a fire. You, angry, return to the fortune teller and she says "well guess the future changed hahahaha no refunds"

So let me make this clear with the capone example
The future- criminal getting shot down by dogtooth
Criminal's intentions- shooting capone's men.
Which of the above two did dogtooth see?





Also capone is wrong no one can change the future.
 
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#306 Enbima

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 11:22 AM

 

the music is good!


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To be effective In combat, a warrior must not feel for his enemy. Close your heart to their desperation. Close your heart for their suffering. The road ahead is long and unforgiving. No place for a boy. You must be a warrior.

- Goku to Gohan.

 stop dreaming


#307 Sesshoumaru

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 09:59 AM

Poor Sanji. This is so dramatic. His lighter doesn't work at all.


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#308 captain kidd

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 10:28 AM

Still cant help but feel there was a better way to do this whole arc.... like have sanji being forced to make those poor choices by threat of his own death. I wouod rather have sanji weak then stupid...
 
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#309 capu

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 05:01 AM

Still cant help but feel there was a better way to do this whole arc.... like have sanji being forced to make those poor choices by threat of his own death. I wouod rather have sanji weak then stupid...

I would like for Sanji to fight, like i mean anyone...does not have to be a powerhouse with a bounty above 300 mill...simply someone..., just finally do something...god damn it....but no now he simply guards the cake.... so damn useless....Bege at least plans ahead...Sanji just wishes to serve the cake......that idiot has not even thought about whom he is going to oppose... cant believe i considered him one of my favs...he has been useless for more than 2 years already....


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#310 Chillman

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 09:59 AM

That cake might be the one thing that saves the crew, even though it probably shouldn't.



#311 captain kidd

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 11:42 AM

That cake might be the one thing that saves the crew, even though it probably shouldn't.


We have been calling this since her hubger rampage started, i am racking my brain trying to think of a worse ending to any story. I sincerely cant think of a time a story has had an ending that god aweful...... "mist" ended with the guy killing his son only to be rescued by the military seconds later..... "cabin in the woods" ended with a stoner refusing to kill himself so the elder gods returned killing him anyway.... "superman vs batman" ended with superman's death.... "avatar" ended with the marines getting kiced off pandora... "pirates 2" ended with jack sparrow's death and a stupid clifhanger forcing us all to see at words end...
NONE of those are as stupid as "feeding a cake to a monster and escaping when she falls asleep" is.
That is brothers grim fairy tale levels of stupid. "Repunsal would allow the evil witch to climb her hair to get into the tower, one day when the witch was half way up the tower repunsal jumped out of the tower killing herself and the witch, the end" even that old time garbage is better then what oda is trying to do here.


Here i will write a better end to wci.
- just when the day seems lost, bm is cloaing in on the sh crew and bege, mayuri, yes mayuri from bleach, shows up, says "i will defeat bm with science" rips off his dead, throws it in BM'S mouth, she eats it, then blows up.- boom, better ending then feeding her a cake. In a strange twist my ending also involved her eating something....weird...

In all seriousness, out of all the times luffy has played hero this has to be the worst and least forgivable. All other times the citizens have been innocent, but this time he is dealing with a group of people who willingly chose to give their life to the service of an emperor who actively destroys islands. Thy literally give a portion of their life, which bm turns into a homie who goes on to serve bm, the insane island destroying monster. These people are not only not innocent, they are morally reprehensible. And luffy is going to save them? Sanji is going to save them? More importantly sanji is going to save bm. Sanji isnt indirectly saving bm he is actually going to stop her from dying, bm, the one who tried to kill him. Sanji threw cannon balls at a bm ship actovely trying to kill bm soldiers, but now he will save her life because she is starving and that is his bs moral code.


You know i was against the "sanji character development" in the form of him hitting women..... i said i am not a fan of hitting women and i dont think that would be a landmark moment, (obviously sanji should hit women when the situation calls for it, but i wont be excited hoping it happens) but i would be happy to see some character development in the form of allowing hungry evil doers to die of starvation.
 
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