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Boruto Chapter 23 Discussion


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#61 waleuska

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 01:54 PM

Just like Sasuke then. XP

Sasuke didn't really do anything bad. He join Orochimaru but what did he tell him about konaha? Orochimaru knew all of konaha's secrets and sasuke knew none. He killed Danzo but Danzo created pain. Let pain destroy konaha and a lot of other crap that should have got him executed. (Orochimaru is a cockroach and couldn't be killed.)


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#62 Baks

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 02:11 PM

Sasuke didn't really do anything bad. He join Orochimaru but what did he tell him about konaha? Orochimaru knew all of konaha's secrets and sasuke knew none. He killed Danzo but Danzo created pain. Let pain destroy konaha and a lot of other crap that should have got him executed. (Orochimaru is a cockroach and couldn't be killed.)


Really?

You conveniently forget Sasuke's numerous acts of treason, murder, attempted murder, assualt, invasion, aiding and abetting a terrorist organization.

Also he has never shown a ounce of remorse or apology for any of his crimes whatsoever.

#63 waleuska

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 02:25 PM

Really?

You conveniently forget Sasuke's numerous acts of treason, murder, attempted murder, assualt, invasion, aiding and abetting a terrorist organization.

Also he has never shown a ounce of remorse or apology for any of his crimes whatsoever.

I always felt what he did wasn't treason. He went after the dude that killed his family. He then went after the dude who order his family death.

 

The only thing he did was invasion.


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#64 Graeystone

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 10:29 PM

I always felt what he did wasn't treason. He went after the dude that killed his family. He then went after the dude who order his family death.

 

The only thing he did was invasion.

Not treason? What the hell do you call putting a frickin' ball of concentrated lightening through Naruto's chest? An tragic training exercise?

 

And as for his family and the rest of the Uchiha, they were planning a coup based on paranoia and absolutely not thinking at all. If Itachi and Sasuke's father had used his brain, he would have realized that Itachi had the potential to become a future Hokage and entrusted him with the future. Everyone had looked up to Itachi. He could have bee the one to bridge peace between Uchiha and the rest of the Village. Instead their father had to listen to the worst person possible and the clan got wipe out. . .and that kind of mind set was clearly passed onto Sasuke who also ended up listening to the worst people possible. . .


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#65 waleuska

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 11:29 PM

Not treason? What the hell do you call putting a frickin' ball of concentrated lightening through Naruto's chest? An tragic training exercise?

 

And as for his family and the rest of the Uchiha, they were planning a coup based on paranoia and absolutely not thinking at all. If Itachi and Sasuke's father had used his brain, he would have realized that Itachi had the potential to become a future Hokage and entrusted him with the future. Everyone had looked up to Itachi. He could have bee the one to bridge peace between Uchiha and the rest of the Village. Instead their father had to listen to the worst person possible and the clan got wipe out. . .and that kind of mind set was clearly passed onto Sasuke who also ended up listening to the worst people possible. . .

Naruto being an asshole that refuse to leave him alone. Sasuke doesn't owe Konaha shit.

 

Agree with that part and sasuke going against konaha after learning about is another thing.


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#66 Baks

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 03:09 AM

Naruto being an asshole that refuse to leave him alone. Sasuke doesn't owe Konaha shit.

Agree with that part and sasuke going against konaha after learning about is another thing.

Sasuke owe's Konoha his loyalty, remember they and the Third in particular helped looked after him after the clan massacre.

What Sasuke did was treason, regardless of what you say. He sided and went over to Oro, an enemy of the village whom they they where actively at war against.

You also ignore Sasuke's unprovoked and malicious assault on Killer Bee, a man who had nothing to with his clan's massacre.

Or how he murdered those guards and Danzou at the Kage Summit.

Or how about his callous abuse of his own comrades, he left Juugo and Sugietsu to die at the Kage Summit - he didn't care about them, Sasuke was more worried about saving his own hide.

Or the fact how he deliberately used Karin as a meat shield to kill Danzou. He didn't care that he deliberately stabbed her to get to Danzou, Sasuke even said that she was a liability to him.


Let alone his multiple murders attempts on Naruto, Sasuke and Kakashi in no less than in cold blood.

Or about Sasuke allying himself with Akatsuki, an known and international terrorist organization.

Even post time skip Sasuke is still an awful shitty person, since he couldn't be bothered for years getting in contact with his wife and kid. Father of the year indeed.

Face it Wale, Sasuke is a scumbag through and through as all the whole manga shows. There is no denying that.
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#67 Graeystone

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 10:44 AM

Naruto being an asshole that refuse to leave him alone. Sasuke doesn't owe Konaha shit.

 

Agree with that part and sasuke going against konaha after learning about is another thing.

"Refused to leave him alone?" Naruto and Co. were ORDERED to bring him back.

 

@Baks

Even post time skip Sasuke is still an awful shitty person, since he couldn't be bothered for years getting in contact with his wife and kid. Father of the year indeed.

 

This is one of the few good things Sasuke actually did when one thinks about it. Everyone at the end of the Fourth War knew the crap Sasuke did. By staying in the village with Sakura and Sarada wouldn't have helped Sarada at all. She would have no doubt gone through the 'Naruto Experience' growing up if Sasuke had hung around.

 

Frankly very few adult fathers can be called 'Shinobi Fathers of the Year'. The fathers to Team 10 and Shino's father were the only ones who clearly weren't stupid/neglectful/verbally abusive toward their kids. I don't include Sakura's father because he's a civilian and we don't know anything about the fathers of Lee and Tenten.

 

Sasuke owe's Konoha his loyalty, remember they and the Third in particular helped looked after him after the clan massacre.

As much as I like Hiruzen, he screwed up. . .big time with Naruto's generation. I think Minato's death and becoming Hokage again kind of 'broke him'. Its not the first time Hiruzen got the job in that kind of situation. He became Hokage twice because the current Hokage(Tobirama and Minato) died a slow painful death in front of his eyes. Because of that he didn't get Sasuke the psychological(Ikibi is a 'natural psychologist') help he needed, he never told Hiashi to get his own act together concerning Hinata and Neji, and of course Naruto. . .yeah.

 

What is annoying about Sasuke is that he LIED to the people who tried to help him and show him a different path that didn't include revenge. He took oaths(to be a loyal Leaf-nin) and made promises(never to abuse Chidori) and broke them all. Whatever screw ups other people made post-Uchiha massacre the point still remains - Sasuke made his own mistakes by giving into some nasty temptations from Orochimaru and Tobi.

 

Edited by Graeystone, 26 May 2018 - 11:09 AM.

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#68 waleuska

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 12:16 PM

Sasuke owe's Konoha his loyalty, remember they and the Third in particular helped looked after him after the clan massacre.

What Sasuke did was treason, regardless of what you say. He sided and went over to Oro, an enemy of the village whom they they where actively at war against.

You also ignore Sasuke's unprovoked and malicious assault on Killer Bee, a man who had nothing to with his clan's massacre.

Or how he murdered those guards and Danzou at the Kage Summit.

Or how about his callous abuse of his own comrades, he left Juugo and Sugietsu to die at the Kage Summit - he didn't care about them, Sasuke was more worried about saving his own hide.

Or the fact how he deliberately used Karin as a meat shield to kill Danzou. He didn't care that he deliberately stabbed her to get to Danzou, Sasuke even said that she was a liability to him.


Let alone his multiple murders attempts on Naruto, Sasuke and Kakashi in no less than in cold blood.

Or about Sasuke allying himself with Akatsuki, an known and international terrorist organization.

Even post time skip Sasuke is still an awful shitty person, since he couldn't be bothered for years getting in contact with his wife and kid. Father of the year indeed.

Face it Wale, Sasuke is a scumbag through and through as all the whole manga shows. There is no denying that.

1. Why didn't he tell him the truth about itachi? Loyalty is earn it isn't a right. They did the bare minimal to try to win over sasuke.

 

I will agree with you on everything after itachi die was bad but for wasn't.

 

 

"Refused to leave him alone?" Naruto and Co. were ORDERED to bring him back.

 

@Baks

Even post time skip Sasuke is still an awful shitty person, since he couldn't be bothered for years getting in contact with his wife and kid. Father of the year indeed.

 

This is one of the few good things Sasuke actually did when one thinks about it. Everyone at the end of the Fourth War knew the crap Sasuke did. By staying in the village with Sakura and Sarada wouldn't have helped Sarada at all. She would have no doubt gone through the 'Naruto Experience' growing up if Sasuke had hung around.

 

Frankly very few adult fathers can be called 'Shinobi Fathers of the Year'. The fathers to Team 10 and Shino's father were the only ones who clearly weren't stupid/neglectful/verbally abusive toward their kids. I don't include Sakura's father because he's a civilian and we don't know anything about the fathers of Lee and Tenten.

 

Sasuke owe's Konoha his loyalty, remember they and the Third in particular helped looked after him after the clan massacre.

As much as I like Hiruzen, he screwed up. . .big time with Naruto's generation. I think Minato's death and becoming Hokage again kind of 'broke him'. Its not the first time Hiruzen got the job in that kind of situation. He became Hokage twice because the current Hokage(Tobirama and Minato) died a slow painful death in front of his eyes. Because of that he didn't get Sasuke the psychological(Ikibi is a 'natural psychologist') help he needed, he never told Hiashi to get his own act together concerning Hinata and Neji, and of course Naruto. . .yeah.

 

What is annoying about Sasuke is that he LIED to the people who tried to help him and show him a different path that didn't include revenge. He took oaths(to be a loyal Leaf-nin) and made promises(never to abuse Chidori) and broke them all. Whatever screw ups other people made post-Uchiha massacre the point still remains - Sasuke made his own mistakes by giving into some nasty temptations from Orochimaru and Tobi.

 

 

Once again look above the did the bare minimal. They didn't try to win over sasuke they didn't tell him the truth they just stuck him with a team and said here you go. 

 

Look at it this way. He was a 13 year child soldier that had to do what konaha wanted.


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#69 Graeystone

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 04:07 PM

1. Why didn't he tell him the truth about itachi? Loyalty is earn it isn't a right. They did the bare minimal to try to win over sasuke.

 

I will agree with you on everything after itachi die was bad but for wasn't.

 

Once again look above the did the bare minimal. They didn't try to win over sasuke they didn't tell him the truth they just stuck him with a team and said here you go. 

 

Look at it this way. He was a 13 year child soldier that had to do what konaha wanted.

Because its what Itachi wanted. Itachi felt it was better that he was the 'villain' instead of the whole clan.

Sasuke - "WHY!"

Itachi - "Because the clan was going to rebel against the village and cause a civil war which would have destroyed everyone."

OR

Sasuke - "WHY!"

Itachi - "Because the clan is weak and I need to test my strength."

Which one would have caused the least damage to Kohona?

 

Itachi's mistake was thinking hatred and through that revenge was the way to 'kill the villain' and 'redeem the clan'. Although a genius, Itachi was still a fourteen year old kid with the same teenage mentality concerning such things. If he had just said his motive and left hatred out of it then maybe Sasuke would not have been so greatly influenced by Itachi's words.

 

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#70 waleuska

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 04:14 PM

 

Because its what Itachi wanted. Itachi felt it was better that he was the 'villain' instead of the whole clan.

Sasuke - "WHY!"

Itachi - "Because the clan was going to rebel against the village and cause a civil war which would have destroyed everyone."

OR

Sasuke - "WHY!"

Itachi - "Because the clan is weak and I need to test my strength."

Which one would have caused the least damage to Kohona?

 

Itachi's mistake was thinking hatred and through that revenge was the way to 'kill the villain' and 'redeem the clan'. Although a genius, Itachi was still a fourteen year old kid with the same teenage mentality concerning such things. If he had just said his motive and left hatred out of it then maybe Sasuke would not have been so greatly influenced by Itachi's words.

 

 

I get why itachi did what he did but konaha is a different matter.

 

Konaha knew that sasuke had a huge kill boner against itachi. So, what did they do to fix this? Nothing. They could have told sasuke the truth and called him the hero of the village from the shadows. They could done more to help him with his revenge. Got him a team to help him fight itachi or get him a teacher that could help him kill itachi. They did none of these things.


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#71 Graeystone

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Posted 28 May 2018 - 10:34 AM

I get why itachi did what he did but konaha is a different matter.

 

Konaha knew that sasuke had a huge kill boner against itachi. So, what did they do to fix this? Nothing. They could have told sasuke the truth and called him the hero of the village from the shadows. They could done more to help him with his revenge. Got him a team to help him fight itachi or get him a teacher that could help him kill itachi. They did none of these things.

1) Itachi being 'the villain' was more than just to cover up the truth about the Uchiha Massacre. There was also Itachi joining Akatsuki to spy on them. . .which failed. . .sure Itachi was able to drop a few 'clues' in terms of his and Kisame's abilities when he and Kisame sneaked into Kohona and later made a blatant grab for Naruto. In the long run and in terms of the Bigger Picture concerning Akatsuki, he really did nothing of importance.

2) "When seeking revenge. . .first dig two graves."

3) The best thing that could have happened was Sasuke be removed the Academy but if that happened, Sasuke would have left on his own or somehow got mixed up with someone like Danzo in a very bad way. Also the absolute final secret behind the Uchiha Massacre was something Kohona leadership  did not know - That Fugaku knew what was going to happen and were okay with it.

 

Edited by Graeystone, 28 May 2018 - 10:35 AM.

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